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 Post subject: Re: My Father, Rua Alguem 5555
PostPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 4:11 pm 
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Prince Judah
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'Mocumentary', yeah, right! Thanks a lot for this brilliant word-pun. I should be sent to Michael Moore.

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 Post subject: Re: My Father, Rua Alguem 5555
PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 12:47 pm 
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El Cid
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The way Michael Moore treated the aged and ailing Charlton Heston was a total disgrace. Even decent minded people who opposed Heston were against it, including Al Gore. "I never thought I would ever feel sympathy for Charlton Heston" Gore said after viewing the shenanagins of Michael Moore.

Come to think of it, we haven't got a BOWLING FOR COLUMBINE section on this Heston Forum. Thorn should start one and I'll give Moore a good pasting on it.


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 Post subject: Re: My Father, Rua Alguem 5555
PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2013 10:20 am 
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El Cid
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Chrysagon
I would be interested to read your thoughts on MY FATHER: RUA ALGUEM 5555.
On another thread on this forum you stated that after viewing the dvd you might have to consider putting this drama into your "Top Ten Heston Movies" list. So I gather you liked it, but I would really like you to elaborate on that statement, please.


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 Post subject: Re: My Father, Rua Alguem 5555
PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 4:47 pm 
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Prince Judah
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We are glad that we have been able to make a bold campaign for increasing the audience of this less known jewel of Chuck's performances ... thanks to you, tizzy, and Thorny!

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 Post subject: Re: My Father, Rua Alguem 5555
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 3:43 am 
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Prince Judah
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James Byrne wrote:
Chrysagon
I would be interested to read your thoughts on MY FATHER: RUA ALGUEM 5555.
On another thread on this forum you stated that after viewing the dvd you might have to consider putting this drama into your "Top Ten Heston Movies" list. So I gather you liked it, but I would really like you to elaborate on that statement, please.

As someone else mentioned earlier in this thread, I was waiting to watch the film a 2nd time before giving any detailed response; unfortunately, I haven't been able to squeeze in that couple of hours again, as yet. I'll try to relate something at this point.

A couple of years ago, I had a rather strenuous debate with someone on another board regarding films and our expectations of them. The other person's opinion was that the purpose of films was to entertain, period. I disagreed in that he was applying his theory to all films and I felt that there were certain films which functioned as more than just simple entertainment. To use a more famous example, if all a person got out of Schindler's List (1993) was simple entertainment, then I would question that person's sanity and coherence. I think that My Father, Rua Alguem 5555 also falls into this category.

This view of certain films also becomes a double-edged sword, because discussion about such a film becomes a more touchy subject - it's not a 'feel good' type of film, for one thing - and it may be controversial. And, I think that a person such as the one I had debated with would consciously avoid films like this - but that's another discussion. The question also becomes how well does such a film present its ideas - does the viewer come away with some new awareness, for example? I think Heston's film does indeed succeed at that level; some of the evidence is in this very thread, where an unpleasant subject matter has been expounded upon (mostly by James Byrne). It may not be pleasant but it is the truth, is it not?

I'm not at all familiar with the director - I believe he's Italian - but it seems like he knew what he was doing. The entire structure of the first act builds on an almost mythic presentation of Heston's unseen (up to that point) Mengele character. We see old photos but nothing else to this point. Then, when Heston finally appears, the camera slowly winds upward from his feet until we finally see the actual man - it is the mythic monster now finally made flesh. As I said, it seems that the director knew what he was doing - or was it the script? Was it Heston himself?

The first scene of Heston actually speaking has an almost poetic tone - he speaks of Odysseus and his voyages. I admit I was very taken with these scenes... and surprised. Heston really rose to the challenge in this one and it is a very focused, intense performance. It's a tribute to his strength of will because, as already mentioned, he was already ill at the time. Could Heston have been using the method here -- at least in some scenes? I have to watch the film a 2nd time. Besides, this post is getting too long. I'll get back to you on this.


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 Post subject: Re: My Father, Rua Alguem 5555
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 8:41 am 
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El Cid
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Thanks for that very interesting response, Chrysagon. I had the same feeling as you did when viewing Heston's first scene; and his acting in his final big scene when expounding his Darwenian theory to his son was intensely powerful. Heston gave it all he had in that highly emotional scene and I'm so pleased that he ended his career on a high.

I'm looking forward to your views when you watch the movie again.


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 Post subject: Re: My Father, Rua Alguem 5555
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 5:24 am 
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Prince Judah
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Chrysagon wrote:

The entire structure of the first act builds on an almost mythic presentation of Heston's unseen (up to that point) Mengele character. We see old photos but nothing else to this point. Then, when Heston finally appears, the camera slowly winds upward from his feet until we finally see the actual man - it is the mythic monster now finally made flesh.

The first scene of Heston actually speaking has an almost poetic tone - he speaks of Odysseus and his voyages. I admit I was very taken with these scenes... and surprised.


Judah wrote, on June 7, 2012:

Quote:
Have you noticed the epical allusion in the movie? ...On the public and broader level, the story progresses against the backdrop of the post World WarII reality -- Germany's national and international attitude in politics after the Nazi regime is over, the trauma of the holocaust period and concentration camps. That is an epical backdrop, I feel. On a private level, remember the scene where Josef Mengele talks of his 'adventures'(in order to escape the 'price' that is set upon his head, as a war-criminal) to his son after he enters his cottage.

Mengele compares himself to Ulysses-- "like Ulysses I have travelled from this country to that, this island to that, and like Ulysses..." Now, if Josef Mengele is Ulysses, Herman is like Telemachus who searches his long-lost father. But here is the irony. Mengele is not venturing through this island and that to return home, he has no home, he cannot come back to Germany as his homeland. And his son searches him only to confront him with his past guilt, to challenge him with a son's judgement of his father's dark past life, not to embrace him in pure filial emotion. So the Ulysses-Telemachus story is parodied and subverted. This makes me feel that the movie is an 'epic' and a parody of 'epic' at the same time.


See? Great men think alike! :lol: ;)

I also agree with your idea of a mythical 'giant', Sir Chrysagon, and would like to add something. In Classical times(Greek and Roman), there was a concept of 'Homosaser'(not the exact Latin word, it is almost impossible to reproduce in English, i.e., a man who is too great in his 'inhumanity'(or super-humanity) that ordinary human laws cannot do anything against. He is too much beyond his fellow-humans, that he is not to be tackled by human society and its common bonds and logic, he had committed so much wrong by the ordinary view that his vices had come to a point of satiation and given him an uncanny sense of sanctity. Nobody except the almighty Providence can judge him. He becomes a 'daemon',a word connoting both divine and demonic. Oedipus in the final play of Sophocles' trilogy, is such a mythic daemon, who defends his past shame with the same vigour and confidence of Mengele. There is a hunt for him, from state-authorities and politic-powers, but he escapes every pursuit and had his end at his own right. His death is also mysterious, he got disappeared in the elements, among thunder, lightning and storm. And what happens to Mengel at the end? Nobody can touch him, or punish him according to human law, he gets drowned and disappeared retaining his mythic status. It is an 'elemental' death for him, too: 'death by drowning' is an archetypal metaphor of getting 'dissolved' among the elements. And the hunt for him goes in vain as well. The mythic representation is very well incorporated into the modern postwar setting and context.

Yeah, we can say it with all possibilities: The director seemed to have a feeling of what he was doing, and Chuck also knew that.

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 Post subject: Re: My Father, Rua Alguem 5555
PostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2013 3:27 pm 
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El Cid
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This movie has a little scene of Heston as Mengele dancing. This got me thinking - how many other movies does Heston have a dance?
Off hand, I can only think of THE BIG COUNTRY (with Carroll Baker), RUBY GENTRY (with Jennifer Jones), LUCY GALLANT (with Jane Wyman) and 55 DAYS AT PEKING (with Ava Gardner) but there must be more than that, surely?


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 Post subject: Re: My Father, Rua Alguem 5555
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 8:00 pm 
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Interesting question, I can't think of any other one at this time.

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 Post subject: Re: My Father, Rua Alguem 5555
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 9:19 pm 
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Michelangelo

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James Byrne wrote:
This movie has a little scene of Heston as Mengele dancing. This got me thinking - how many other movies does Heston have a dance?
Off hand, I can only think of THE BIG COUNTRY (with Carroll Baker), RUBY GENTRY (with Jennifer Jones), LUCY GALLANT (with Jane Wyman) and 55 DAYS AT PEKING (with Ava Gardner) but there must be more than that, surely?



In The Far Horizons (1955), Heston (as Lt. William Clark) danced with Barbara Hale (as Julia Hancock). He also danced with Donna Reed (as Sacajawea).

In Gideon (1999), Heston (as Addison Sinclair) danced with Shirley Jones (as Elly Morton). Probably it was just a very short scene.

In Studio One -- Wuthering Heights (30 Oct. 1950), Heston (as Heathcliff) danced with June Dayton (as Isabella Linton).

:cheers:


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